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MAKING CONTACT

Transcript: #20-00 A Popular Uprising: A Look at Ecuador's Coup
May 17, 2000

Program description, guest contact information and audio files at http://www.radioproject.org/archive/2000/0020.html

Phillip Babich: This week on Making Contact....

Colonel Lucio Gutierrez: Our objective, was not to take power. Our objective was firstly to defend the constitution. Secondly it was a persuasive protest against corruption in order to get the people to react. We did it to make them the protagonists of their own destiny.

Miguel Lluco: We are fighting for life, not only for the lives of humans, of people, but for the lives of all living beings: animals, plants, rivers, the environment.

Phillip Babich: On January 21, 2000, Ecuador became the location of the first Latin American coup d'etat in over a decade. On this program, we take a look at the uprising, its fallout, and the new power of Ecuador's indigenous movement. I'm Phillip Babich, your host this week on Making Contact, an international radio program, seeking to create connections between people, vital ideas, and important information.

Many in Ecuador are calling the dramatic events of January, a levantamiento popular, a popular uprising rather than a coup. The revolt was non-violent and was lead by an indigenous movement with wide-spread support throughout the country and backing from some sectors of the military. The uprising followed a year of disastrous bank failures, out-of-control inflation, and austere economic policies imposed by the World Bank and International Monetary Fund.

Miguel Lluco is a coordinator for Pachakutik, an indigenous political movement which is a member of the umbrella coalition, Indigenous Nationalities Confederation of Ecuador, known as CONAIE. He says the implementation of IMF, World Bank proscribed policies and his country's economic downturn, hit Ecuador's poor particularly hard, sparking discontent. President Jamil Mahuad further angered many Ecuadorians, when in January. Just before the uprising, he proposed a risky strategy, known as dollarization, to replace the national currency with the U.S. dollar.

Miguel Lluco: It's very clear what the neoliberal economic policies that have been used here have meant for the majority of Ecuadorians - that it's harder and harder to find the funds to cover basic necessities, for food, for education, health, for housing. So in recent times we have seen proposals being made such as dollarization. So these were the elements that caused the Ecuadorian people, led by the CONAIE and social unions, to act. The events of January signify something not seen before in our country, in which a large number of colonels and other officers from the Ecuadorian army participated, together with the general populace and the Indians. They participated because they saw that our demands were fair and that what we were proposing was right.

We have said that the authorities have been breaking the constitution and breaking the rules whenever they have wanted to. They froze and stole the funds of thousands of Ecuadorians in the banks that had their accounts; when people are not attended to, to be treated in hospitals, when the lives of human beings, of men, women and children are being threatened, when there aren't resources so that our children can go to school to be educated.

Phillip Babich: Three-fifths of Ecuador's population lives in poverty. During President Mahuad's one year in power, the value of the national currency, the sucre, dropped by eighty percent. Meanwhile, prices for food and fuel skyrocketed. Throughout the 1990s CONAIE repeatedly mobilized thousands of Indians from the country side, to stage mass protests in the capital of Quito that would effectively shut the city down. But the January 21st popular uprising was different. Mahuad's dollarization proposal had provoked a fire storm. CONAIE and other organizations said the plan would, "dollarize poverty and privatize wealth." That day, upwards of 20,000 indigenous protestors crowded into Quito and some 500 military personnel and a group of rouge colonels allowed the protestors to occupy the Congress building. Soon, a three man junta, CONAIE's president Atonio Vargas, army colonel Lucio Gutierrez, and retired supreme court justice Carlos Solorzano, was greeting crowds from the balcony of the presidential palace.

Simon Pachano is a member of the Latin American Faculty for Social Sciences in Quito and frequently comments on Ecuadorian politics in the international press.

Simon Pachano: Why did it happen at that moment? I think there are many reasons. The government of Jamil Mahuad had deteriorated enormously, the economy had slid out of his hands, most obviously shown by the exchange rate, with the dollar, and the depreciation of the sucre, that was especially severe in December and January. And also people's general dissatisfaction with the government of Mahuad, who seemed incapable of governing and who seemed very tied to specific interests, especially those of bankers and of various powerful economic groups, which made his position in the presidency practically untenable.

The Indians had foreseen the uprising from a long time before. Throughout the month of January they had planned an uprising against three powers of the state, not only against the government, but also against Congress and the Supreme Court. But the Indians alone were not capable of ousting the government. If the military had not participated, this would not have happened. Therefore, the military is a fundamental factor. I don't think that there was necessarily a military-indigenous plot planned beforehand, involving the entire armed forces or the main elements of them. I think there was the same dissatisfaction, within the armed forces, that a large part of the Ecuadorian people felt a strong feeling against corruption.

Phillip Babich: Accusations of corruption, stemmed from a banking crisis that began in March, 1999, when fourteen banks collapsed. The Ecuadorian government threw hundreds of millions of dollars into the system and then outraged the public by freezing bank accounts to raise money for the bail-out. As rumors swirled, government officials and bankers swiftly moved their own funds out of the country.

One of the three men who took charge in the Presidential Palace on the night of January 21st, army Colonel Lucio Gutierrez, told Making Contact about his motives, and why other officers broke ranks to join the protesting Indians.

Colonel Lucio Gutierrez: We have always said that the country is below God and above everything else, including the military as an institution and also our families. Therefore, we couldn't remain inactive, we couldn't remain unperturbed or confronted with the waste of the country's funds, and people's money. Over the previous months and especially during the government of Dr Jamil Mahuad, a series of blatantly corrupt acts were committed. The state constitution was violated systematically. Given such constant criminal acts to satisfy the demands of a small group of shameless bankers and business leaders, the military must defend the people, as well as maintaining its integrity and territorial sovereignty.

We believe that the armed forces are justified in taking measures to defend the people. So what we did was simply to spontaneously, voluntarily and decisively join the protest that the people, Ecuadorian people, poor people, marginalized people, exploited people were carrying out, and which was being led by our indigenous people. You know that our Indians have been exploited for around about 500 years, so we believed that the moment had come to say no more exploitation. To say no more vile corruption, which only increased the poverty of Ecuador's twelve million people. We joined the Indians in their protest and later that contributed to the fall of the government of Jamil Mahuad.

Shereen Meraji: You're listening to Making Contact, a production of the National Radio Project. If you want more information about the subject of this week's program, please give us a call. It's toll free: 800-529-5736. Call that same phone number for tape and transcript orders. That's 800-529-5736.

Phillip Babich: The coup was short lived. Several hours into it, Colonel Gutierrez and the other plotters turned power over to the armed forces' chief of staff, General Carlos Mendoza. The U.S. State Department and the Organization of American States, immediately called Mendoza warning him of isolation, akin to that of Cuba. Also, senior white house policy makers called to express their concern for constitutional order, threatening to end all bilateral aid and World Bank lending to Ecuador. The next morning, General Mendoza dissolved the junta and turned the reins over to President Mahuad's vice president, Gustavo Noboa. Colonel Gutierrez says he is not surprised or particularly dismayed by the outcome, because to some extent, the uprising had fulfilled it's goals.

Colonel Lucio Gutierrez: Our objective was not to take power. Our objective was firstly to defend the constitution which had been systematically violated by the government of Dr Mahuad. Secondly it was a persuasive protest against corruption in order to get the people to react, so that they would stop being passive, so that they would stop being witnesses to the debacle of our country. We did it to raise the people's self-esteem, to make them the protagonists of their own destiny. That was what we were attempting, to bring about a change of attitude in the population. It wasn't our objective to take power. And for that reason, once we arrived at the presidential palace we handed over power. If our ambition had been to stay in power we wouldn't have handed it over just like that. The idea was to pressurize the democratic institutions of our country into strengthening themselves, allowing the participation of all citizens. In Ecuador democracy has been reduced to elections, the candidates deceive the people with all manner of promises that they never fulfill. Once the candidates get into power they forget about the people, and they use their power for their own personal benefit. That's not democracy. So that is what we were fighting against, against that pseudo-democracy. Because corruption is the main enemy of democracy, not us, not the people.

Phillip Babich: Nina Pacari, an indigenous leader and a member of Ecuador's Congress, says corruption and severe economic inequity in her country are partially the result of World Bank and International Monetary Fund influence and policies.

Nina Pacari: What the government has demonstrated is that it is following the IMF's recipe. Here in Ecuador there has been a history of following the instructions given by the IMF. The crisis we are seeing is a crisis caused also by the economic models adopted and imposed by the IMF under the pretext of giving away more credit, and as a result it has led to a policy of poverty and debt and it is the consequences of those policies that we are suffering. Even the Vice President of the World Bank recognized the error of the World Bank in its application of programs that were not suitable to bring Latin American countries out of their crises. And in the case of the indigenous uprising on January 21st, like the previous uprisings there has been a clear rejection of not only government policy, but also those of the IMF. In this case it was an uprising against corruption and a corrupt government and also against the policies of the IMF, which instead of resolving problems, has made them worse.

Phillip Babich: The now-deposed government of Jamil Mahuad had been closely following IMF-imposed structural adjustment edicts, such as using government funds to prop up shaky banks and raising prices of many consumer goods to international levels. Mahuad found himself in a bind when his government failed to secure new IMF loans, to help cover foreign debt payments. In September 1999, Ecuador defaulted on half of its thirteen billion dollar foreign debt.

In the wake of January's political turmoil, the IMF quickly shed it's reluctance to help the Ecuadorian government. In March, 2000, the IMF hastily approved a long delayed three year package of 2 billion dollars in loans to the new government of President Noboa. This loan may help to temporarily stabilize the new government, but it may not help Ecuador out of a deep economic crisis. President Noboa is proceeding with the controversial policy of dollarization as is stipulated by the IMF, in its new loan package to Ecuador.

Congresswoman Nina Pacari says dollarization will hurt the poor majority of Ecuadorians.

Nina Pacari: Even experts have said that the dollarization monetary scheme will in no way resolve the country's problems. And even if the scheme works, it won't resolve anything. The country needs to be aware -- and the indigenous people are already aware of this -- that this monetary program, although it might correct monetary policy, will not solve the crisis. It may be true that with this system credit will arrive, but it's a credit that has to be paid back; it's a credit that increases the foreign debt; it's a credit that in the state budget will increase funds at the cost of investment. So instead of solving problems it's going to make them worse, if you look at it from a short-term perspective, and even more so from a medium or long-term perspective.

But the monetary correction system, that is dollarization, generates an increase in prices of goods and services and as the objective is to put them at international levels, the access to these goods and services will be virtually impossible because salaries are frozen. Salaries are not increasing. Just with the announcement of the dollarization plan, prices have risen five-fold. So there is a salary problem, a revenue problem, with a sharp rise in the prices of goods and services at all levels and the economy of the poorest classes is deteriorating. With this system there are winners and losers, who in this case are the poor, while there are powerful groups which with this plan have become much wealthier, and the polarization between rich and poor is much greater.

Phillip Babich: There's also the question of where the IMF's two billion dollars will actually end up. A valid concern, says Miguel Lluco, of the indigenous Pachacutic movement, given the history of corruption among Ecuador's political and economic elite.

Miguel Lluco: Those funds will go first of all to the private sector and that means the bankers. We don't trust them at all, because they've caused the country's crisis. Ex-president Jamil Mahuad gave these people billions of sucres. Now dollars are going to arrive and they will be given to the same people, so there won't be any solution. We have proposed to the international organizations that they shouldn't continue supporting the same thieves who have stolen so much. So giving funds to thieves is not a solution to the problem.

The solution is in listening to the proposals of the Ecuadorian people and implementing a plan that represents the majority view of the Ecuadorian people. Because it's not as if they're giving us money, they are loaning it to us. So what happens now is that the foreign debt increases, and we're already spending 54% of the budget on debt. So with the increase in debt that we'll have, we'll have to designate sixty or seventy percent of the budget just to service the debt, and so we can't talk about finding a way out of the crisis that way.

Phillip Babich: The new round of IMF loans comes with structural adjustment conditions attached, including continued wage restraints and increases in subsidized fuel prices. Ecuador is also required to privatize public utilities. Supporters of the IMF, say its structural adjustment policies strengthen democracy and reduce poverty. But, Miguel Lluco disagrees with this assessment.

Miguel Lluco: The international organizations and media together have covered up and been accomplices to the evils of Ecuador and to those who are corrupt, that's what they have done. And in the name of what? In the name of defending democracy. What they have done is defend the democracy of thieves, the democracy of liars, the democracy of people who have not been capable of working. So that is the kind of democracy that those organizations have been trying to defend and they haven't listened to the outcry of eleven million Ecuadorians, who are totally opposed to that kind of democracy and to the kind of attitudes that our governments has had.

Phillip Babich: The question of what democracy really means within a political and economic system, suffused with radical inequality, permanent indebtedness, and high level corruption, is a vital concern for the instigators of Ecuador's brief January revolution. The indigenous movement is trying to articulate a new set of democratic ideals, calling for a more active civic participation, that goes beyond merely voting on election day.

Army Colonel Lucio Gutierrez says these ideals are largely a response to the perception that the government of Ecuador has long been a kind of feeding trough for insiders.

Colonel Lucio Gutierrez: We wanted to strengthen the democratic institutions so that there would be more freedom. What is the purpose of democracy? What were the ideals of democracy? To seek equality, to seek freedom, to fight against oppression. And one of the forms of neo-slavery and oppression is corruption. So our protest was against exactly that. Our civic battle was against that corrupt system. The main enemy of democracies, especially in Latin America and also around the world, is corruption. Corruption is the main enemy. And there is not one organization, not in the Organization of American States or the United Nations, which as far as I can see, has a strong or specific program to fight corrupt governments. They could sanction a corrupt government, they could sanction a government that is harming its own people, if they really did have a democratic spirit. But there is a kind of bad team spirit which means that supposed democratic governments cover each others' backs.

Phillip Babich: By contrast, the indigenous communities in Ecuador are the locusts of political ferment and considerable moral authority. Ecuador's indigenous population of over 4 million, one-third of the countries 5 million inhabitants, is made up of twelve nations,the Quichua being the largest. The twelve nations are politically organized under CONAIE, the Indigenous Nationalities Confederation of Ecuador. Formed in 1986, CONAIE grew, in part, as a response to the impact of globalization policies in Ecuador. CONAIE has developed an economic and political plan that calls for the creation of a multi-nation state that recognizes the autonomy and rights of the twelve indigenous nations. One of CONAIE's objectives has been to redefine and implement inclusive forms of democracy. CONAIE has pursued a strategy of participatory democracy, implementing what are called 'popular parliaments.' These are forms for indigenous nation members to submit proposals to solve specific community problems.

CONAIE's political reach is substantial, influencing decisions at the local, regional, and national levels. While highly effective at mobilizing demonstrations, protests and strikes, the indigenous movement has also been distinguished by its peaceful means. A reflection of the values of Ecuador's Indians, says indigenous leader, Miguel Lluco.

Miguel Lluco: Up until this moment, we have been peaceful in Ecuador. All our actions have been characterized by a respect for life and not harming anyone, be they Indians or the poor or the authorities who themselves have caused harm. That is how the indigenous peoples of Ecuador behave, because we have seen close up how our neighbor country to the north has suffered due to the armed confrontations with which people have been seeking to resolve their problems. We have seen what has happened in Peru. We have followed closely what happened in El Salvador, in Nicaragua, in Guatemala. So we will do whatever possible in order to avoid the kind of actions that lead to bloodshed, which don't adhere to our sense of logic.

We are fighting for life, not only for the lives of humans, of people, but for the lives of all living beings: animals, plants, rivers, the environment, so we have a global vision. That means we can't use the same arms that they use. They use them with the police, the armed forces, they use arms to put a gag on hunger. Instead of arming ourselves we would rather carry out, with the majority of Ecuadorians, peaceful and democratic actions and from there we can get rid of the wrong people who are in our institutions so that we can get on with the political administration of the state, which we can do honorably. So our aspiration is to keep moving on. We will fight to the death against wrong. It is a fight of life against death. That is our fight, those are our aspirations, dreams, and efforts.

Phillip Babich: Since the dramatic events of last January, indigenous leaders and their military accomplices have settled into a wait and see attitude. CONAIE offered the new government of Gustavo Noboa a six month grace period to begin to meet the needs of the nations poor. Meanwhile, CONAIE is undertaking a referendum on dollarization, hoping to document the opposition of millions of Ecuadorians to the plan.

While the indigenous movement is committed to a non-violent struggle, CONAIE president and coup veteran, Antonio Vargas has threatened, "a great popular uprising, if they don't see results." Indian Congresswoman Nina Pacari:

Nina Pacari: The indigenous movement is prepared to talk with the government, but as long as the government lacks the political will to carry out its promises, the indigenous people will always voice their concerns. Right now there are openings for dialogue, but while the government doesn't provide concrete solutions, these won't progress. The president of the Republic hasn't given concrete answers regarding a number of issues. For example, the development plan for the Indian communities is not being carried out and. To carry out the program a legal framework is needed which would free up resources, in this case that would be a development fund for the indigenous communities.

Phillip Babich: As for military involvement in a future uprising, Colonel Lucio Gutierrez..

Colonel Lucio Gutierrez: No, I don't think so. Because the Ecuadorian people are waiting right now. There has been a series of announcements which say that corruption will be fought. The authorities have announced that they will begin legal action against corrupt bankers, and that they will start extradition proceedings against fugitives of the Ecuadorian justice system, especially against those who have committed fraud and are abroad - some of them are in the U.S. And we're waiting.

Phillip Babich: It's understood that the indigenous movement could not have engineered a full scale coup without the militaries help. So as Indian leaders look ahead to future actions, will they look again for the support of the armed forces? Nina Pacari:

Nina Pacari: We have carried out uprisings with and without the military. In this case there are two different groups which can't be lumped together and in that context the indigenous movement is autonomous and has its own structure and perspective and so it will decide alone when is the best moment to carry out another protest. It does count on support from social groups -depending on their standpoints- and what we have here is an indigenous movement that is solid, structured and organized, with a standpoint and the decision when to carry out another protest will be taken by the appropriate people, the indigenous leaders, acting in a representative way. That is a decision which doesn't require the support or decision of other social groups.

Phillip Babich: That's it for this edition of Making Contact, a look at recent upheaval in Ecuador. Thanks for listening and special thanks this week Nate Binzen, who wrote and helped produce this show. We had voice-over assistance from Rosi Reyes, Roberto Leni, and Jorge Perez Molina.

Laura Livoti is our managing director. Peggy Law is executive director. Associate producer is Stephanie Welch; senior advisor Norman Solomon; national producer, David Barsamian; Women's Desk coordinator, Lisa Rudman; Prison Desk coordinator, Eli Rosenblatt; production assistant, Shereen Meraji; archivist, Din Abdullah. And I'm your host and managing producer, Phillip Babich.

If you want more information about the subject of this week's program, call the National Radio Project, at: 800-529-5736. Call that same phone number for tapes and transcripts. You can also go to our website at www.radioproject.org.

Making Contact is an independent production, we're committed to providing a forum for voices and opinions not often heard in the mass media. If you have suggestions for future programs, we'd like to hear from you. Our theme music is by the Charlie Hunter Trio. Bye for now.