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MAKING CONTACT Transcript: #25-99 Where to Turn: Queer Youth, Support and Identity Phillip Babich: This week on Making Contact: Lynx: Before they know it, they're trying to convince themselves that they're straight, and that they need a man, and that they're going to grow a bobcut. You know, throw on a poodle skirt, learn how to bake brownies...you know, before they know it, they don't lead a life, because it's been already laid out for them. Phillip Babich: It's hard enough growing up...but many young people encounter added difficulties with social acceptance and, in some cases, harassment, because they're queer. About one-fourth of all teenage runaways and an equal percentage of homeless youth are gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered, queer or questioning. On this program, you'll hear from some of these young people. We'll talk with them about their experiences and how they are organizing networks of support. I'm Phillip Babich, your host this week on Making Contact, an international radio program seeking to create connections between people, vital ideas, and important information. Many programs offering support to lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgendered, queer and questioning youth warn that the lack of accurate information about sexual orientation and lack of support for youth increases the chance for them to drop out of school, run away from home, abuse drug and alcohol, contract HIV, and commit suicide. In fact, they are three times more likely to attempt suicide than other young people. Most homeless youth are survivors of physical or sexual abuse and have left home to escape such treatment. And, about 25 percent of all homeless youth are lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgendered. Many stereotypes about homeless people, and homeless youth particularly, are inaccurate. For instance, in the United States, about a quarter of the homeless population hold jobs. Statistics on homeless youth are difficult to compile because many kids will not attempt to make use of services for fear they will be returned to the violent homes they fled. But in New York City, advocates for homeless youth estimate that between 15 thousand and 20 thousand young people are on the streets there. In San Francisco, over 2,000 homeless or runaway youth are served each year by the city's Homeless Youth Network. Eloise Magenheim, an outreach worker with the San Francisco Neighborhood Safety Partnership, visited a number of kids on the city's streets and asked them about their experiences. Lynx is an eighteen-year old lesbian who has been homeless for almost seven years. She returned home briefly at the age of twelve, but decided she was actually better off elsewhere. Lynx: I've been running away since I was seven years old. I was locked up in a mental institution because I tried to kill myself multiple times when I was seven, because I was really damaged by being severely abused when I was five by one of my mother's close friends. And I couldn't take it and I emotionally broke down. And ever since then, I've been running away from that, and my family unit and myself that I once knew, running away kept me looking forward, you know, and ever since then I've run away periodically when things got too tough, and when I got stuck in a bind. You know, and that was a way to release the tension and frustration and the angst and the apathy that gave me motivation. And, I started leaving home for longer periods of time, when I was like ten, for months at a time, and then go home, be enrolled in school again, and then I would find some way to screw everything up. That was basically outlined for me. You know, people would overextend themselves to me, and I would really shun them away. Inevitably, when I was thirteen I left home, and it's been that way ever since. You know, I started squatting in abandoned warehouses on the banks of Williamsburg in New York City, and then I started staying with girls that I would sleep with, and that kind of ensured a roof over my head. I've tried numerous times to commit suicide; I've tried so hard to put myself at risk, and ultimately I survived and I think there's a reason for that. And there's a reason for me being who I am. And I was in denial of that, you know? And I would flaunt my personality and my character, you know what I mean? I came out at a very early age. I was totally open...I started experimenting when I was about eight years old, with women. I had my first sexual encounter when I was really young, too. And I would just like, abuse my body, you know. The status quo of society which is basically straight, blonde hair, blue eyed, professional males and females. They totally condition us to manipulate our bodies and our sense of self into them, you know what I mean? And if you're not okay with riding the assembly line through life, such as that, then, you're going to hell. You know what I mean? And it feels like hell, you know, having it rubbed in your face day in and day out. You know, in the media and in the institutions that we're raised in. And the family also is an institutions. And religion being the cornerstone of the family, that's also another detrimental implementation into the growth period of adolescence. And, I think it's really imperative that we all realize this. And we stick a wrench in the works of how we're raised, and how we evolve. You know, evolution is an organic experience. It's not mechanical. You know what I'm saying? It's not battery operated. You know, we're human beings and we're all individuals. Phillip Babich: Language relating to sexual preferences and gender-orientation can often be confusing. The term "transgendered," for example, refers to someone who is not necessarily gay, but someone who chooses to identify as -- and dress like -- another gender. Some transgendered people choose to modify their bodies through hormone treatment or surgery. Phoenix is a transgendered woman. She is 21 years old and moved from Chicago to San Francisco to work as a make-up artist, assuming it would be easier to be herself there. But Phoenix found that even within the diverse community in San Francisco, people were not as accepting as she had hoped. She says that even if she's on a date, passersby assume that she must be a prostitute -- or turning a "trick" -- because of the way she's dressed. Phoenix: Actually, San Francisco's a great place if you're a gay male. You know, there's a lot of opportunities for you. I mean, pretty much any store that's paying ten dollars or more, you know, you go in and talk about work or whatever, you can get a job, whether it's social work, or whatever. You know, especially if you want to work, and if your decent, and your appearance is great, yes, of course. But I've had a really hard here, especially with dating somebody. 'Cause if you're walking on the street, they just automatically assume... oh, that's a trick, you know... and when I go in a restaurant, and I love my heels, and I love my short skirts. I mean, it adds, but people shouldn't judge people based on that. I mean, it's mostly the gay men actually. The straight community here, well, that's generally almost everywhere, it's generally more accepting of transsexuals than the gay men, period. But here the gay men look at us like the freaks, and entertainment. They feel as if they are the reason why they don't get respect, and we're which in actuality is not the case. Phillip Babich: Jai is 21 years old and has been homeless for about five years. His mother left him when he was seven. He then went to live with his grandparents, who Jai says were abusive. He ran away at sixteen. Jai: I just came here, I wanted to be a writer, and I wanted to go to school, and every material thing I had was taken from me. Any intellectual prowess I had has been dulled. I feel bleak. I feel like an unsharpened pencil. I don't know, I've been worn down to nothing. And I'm sick of being here. Sick of being around junkies, sick of being around people that don't inspire me. This is major suckville. This is like gentrification capitol number 2. And it's too expensive for young people to live here. I thought maybe someone, one of my elders, would like, teach me or help me or do something positive, other than, like shop, but you know, that's America. I don't know what I expected. I expected it to be like it was in Iowa, where like the queer youth got together, and the queer adults got together, and like we'd hang out and talk and drink, and call each other Mary, and make sure no one puked on themselves and ruined their nice new clothes. As opposed to here where they look at you like you're a scumbag. And if you don't already have it, you're probably not going to get it in San Francisco. If you're not willing to become something you're not willing to like, do drugs, and if you're not willing to give $20 blowjobs, you're probably not going to make it in San Francisco. Stephanie Welch: You're listening to Making Contact, a production of the National Radio Project. For tape and transcripts, call 800-529-5736. Phillip Babich: In 1995 city officials in Atlanta, Georgia, realized that many gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered and questioning young people were seeking support in the city's mental health system. Concerned that there was no safe environment where young people could explore issues related to sexual orientation, a group founded Youth Pride, an organization designed to offer support, outreach and education. It serves about 150 young people weekly, 40 percent of whom are people of color. Making Contact's Lisa Rudman spoke with Leela Chapman, who is bisexual and works with Youth Pride. She is also a board member representing 13 to 18 year olds. Lisa asked Leela what issues she believed young people who are gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered deal with and how those issues differ from what adult's face. Leela Chapman: I think that on these different issues, someone who is an adult is still going to face discrimination and still face difficulties, but you're able to chose where you live, you're able to chose where you work, to some extent. You're able to kind of tailor your life a little bit more, where youth are coming into the world where gay people are more visible now. That's great, but it's also caused a lot of backlash because it's such a visibility now. When you're in high school and in even in college you have a lot less latitude, especially people who've been living with their parents. Like, I've been very lucky; my parents are very supportive of me. But kids whose parents are not supportive are left a very hard choice. They have to let their parents deal with it; a lot of them are running away. I think it's the same with school. When you're in school, you don't have a choice where you are. So if you're gay and young, I think your situation is a lot more inflexible. Lisa Rudman: You mention about a backlash, Leela. Can you talk more about that? Leela Chapman: Yes. One of the biggest things...I was amazed when I started coming to Youth Pride...I was 15, and I go to a relatively safe school, a very safe school, but people would come in to Group every week, and they'd have stories about being threatened in school, being harassed in school, being ostracized, occasionally being victims of violence, and that kind of thing. Lisa Rudman: When you talk about differences beyond just gay or lesbian or straight, how about within the gay-lesbian youth community? What other sorts of differences and issues do come up amongst you all? Leela Chapman: I think there's a lot. Especially living...I mean, we're in Atlanta, Georgia, which is a very diverse city, both racially and orientation-wise, and everything else. And, coming to Youth Pride, I mean, we have, you know, people coming from all sorts of ethnic backgrounds. We have people coming from, you know, different levels of class and that kind of thing. When you look at mainstream gay media around here, and you look at kind of the whole image that the Atlanta gay community likes to present, it's predominantly like, white, upper-class, looking at one thing or another. The demographics of Youth Pride and the kids who come here really don't reflect that at all, and that doesn't reflect them. Lisa Rudman: What does Youth Pride more reflect? Leela Chapman: It kind of reflects people coming from every little nook and cranny of Atlanta. Lisa Rudman: And so, this issue of class, when you open up the dominant gay media there, can you describe a little more of what you see, and how it's different from your reality? Leela Chapman: Well, basically I see kind of the same things as you see when you look at the straight media, which is...you see, predominantly white, you see upper-class, you see people who've got a certain body type. Lisa Rudman: And what's the effect, do you think, on us, when we don't see ourselves mirrored even in the gay and lesbian press? Leela Chapman: I think it makes us forget that we do come from all different kinds of places, and that we are all different kinds of people. You come to the gay question and say, "Well, I'm gay now," and it's kind of like you need to check the rest of yourself at the door in some way. You know, the rest of your identity doesn't fit. Like the Jeep ad with the gay guys in there, or the Budweiser ad - the expectations. Lisa Rudman: What do you want? What do you want to change? What do you want for yourself as a young bisexual woman? Leela Chapman: What I want, ultimately I got into Youth Pride was because there was this part of me that wasn't fitting into the world I was in. The space that was there for me was too small for the person that I was. I came to Youth Pride to try to expand the space that I was in, to try to find a space that would accept more of me. You know, eventually I found that that happens here too. There's just not enough space for the entire person. And I think that ultimately what I want is just to see people keep working to expand their space like that, to expand perceptions of people - to let the entire person fit. You know, whether that means expanding the gay movement as it is- Phillip Babich: Leela Chapman of Youth Pride. Lisa Rudman also spoke with John Badger, another member of Youth Pride. He says that when racial and class tensions arose in some of their discussion groups, the organization adopted a rule to help address these problems. John Badger: It's actually how to honor diversity rules. I mean, basically what it says is...kind of what Leela says, leave all your junk outside, but if it does come up, than you need to say something about it. If anything makes you feel uncomfortable for whatever reason, if it's, you know, someone made a racist comment, or someone says something classist that you didn't agree with, the point is to really be visible about it. To really stand up and say, "You know, that was racist...that was classist. Let's address that. Because I think that's the biggest problem is that. We all see it every day, but who's going to have the balls to stand up and say, "You know, that offended me." Lisa Rudman: Well, let's pretend I'm a gay white man, middle class, got a great job. Hey, I'm cool, I'm groovy. What's this got to do with me? John Badger: Well, I have to say that I've encountered this a lot actually. And basically the only thing I can say to you is that you're still a member of this community, whether you want to recognize it or not. You're still somewhat affected by what happens in this community. You know, it's the same issues where people don't want to get involved - that is the issue. The only thing I can say to you is that it is your responsibility to make this a better place for all of us. You might have it okay right now, but you never know. You never know where you're going to be in five or ten years, number one. And number two, maybe it's just me, but I really feel a responsibility to make a difference. To make my world a better world. Not just for myself, but for other people. Lisa Rudman: Well, John, what do you say to people that... I'm playing with you here a bit... (that say) "You know, I just want to fit in. I want straight people to accept me. I don't want to rock the boat. I want my little piece of the pie. And it's people like you, you fringey youthful... John Badger: ...big old queen... Lisa Rudman: "...big old queen, you're really messing it up for the rest of us, man." John Badger: Well, the only thing I can say to that is - you know, you got where you are because big old queens like me stood up an said something about it. Lisa Rudman: Say more about that. What do you mean, historically? John Badger: I think that it's been the flamer, the one's what aren't scared of who they are, and who are the one who historically stood up an said, "We're not going to take this any more." Who are the ones who said, "This is not right. We need to have something done about it." Lisa Rudman: Can you just identify yourself? Who are you, and how comfortable do you being who you are out there in Atlanta? John Badger: I'm 20, I'm a college student. I'm also a massage therapist and a waiter and a community activist. I'm totally comfortable with who I am in the city. I have my eyebrows done, my hair is always fabulous, and I have a cute little sculpted goatee going on. And I don't worry about it. I don't worry that people will make comments about my eyebrows. I don't care if people don't like me because I swish my hips when I walk. Lisa Rudman: Can you talk about the Reaching Out in the South Conference? What it was, and what it was trying to do? John Badger: I sure can. The Reaching Out in the South Conference was sponsored by the National Youth Advocacy Coalition, also known as NYAC. It was held in Chapel Hill, North Carolina, earlier this year. And basically, what it is, is a weekend long information getting and giving event. The were different workshops on... some of the ones I went to were starting a grass roots campaign with an issue. A grass roots issue campaign, getting that started. There were racial issues and class issue, and how to open up discussions for them. There was a transgendered issues workshop, which I think is great because the community here overlooks sometimes. Lisa Rudman: How did you feel? You came out of the conference and like, what was... John Badger: Oh, my god, I don't think I felt like this in a long time. I felt so empowered. I felt that we could do whatever we wanted. And I felt we are just, we're starting to get the tools to really make a difference. Phillip Babich: John Badger of Youth Pride speaking with Lisa Rudman. In many parts of the United States, schools are forming support groups for young people who are gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgendered and questioning. In Minneapolis, Minnesota, the organization District 202 provides a host of services for its members. Among them: a youth speaker's bureau, job training, HIV and STD prevention and education, and homeless youth outreach. Jessie Tebbin, a 22-year old lesbian and student at the University of Minnesota, is an intern at District 202. She spoke with Leigh Combs of radio station KFAI about her experiences growing up gay in a small town before leaving for Minneapolis. Jessie Tebbin: I always sort of knew that I was a little bit different growing up there, just because people sort of responded to me differently, I guess. People would call me a dyke in high school, just because I would ask questions. Teachers called me feminazi in high school, just because I ask a teacher if they were going to be studying women's lib movement in our history class, and the teacher would say, "Oh!" And I'm like, "Oh, what?" and "You're that feminazi one I heard about." And it's just like the whole class is like laughing. That's kind of like my high school was. People like a lot of rural high schools, everybody's favorite derogatory term is faggot and everything else. Leigh Combs: So, that you're coming from rural North Dakota, you come to Minneapolis, and what...how is that? Jessie Tebbin: It's a difference. It's not always as positive a difference as I'd like to think it is. Sometimes I feel too safe here, and when I go home, I mean I can drive home in my car with the rainbow sticker on the back, and nobody knows what it means. But I can drive up to Coon Rapids here in Minneapolis with the rainbow sticker on my car, and I've had people try to run me off the road. So there's that difference. In the schools, I think the difference is being addressed here. But, I don't think it's far enough. We have people addressing the issue because it's the politically correct thing to do, without realizing the implications of what they're talking about. You find that sometimes with teachers who have us come in and speak, and they don't prepare their class or us for what we're going to be talking about. It's not necessarily a mean thing to do, it's just ignorance, not thinking things through - just saying, "Well, this will be good diversity training," and not really thinking about it. Although, in my high school I don't even know how we'd talk the administration in to having somebody talk about those issues., I mean I had teachers in my high school arguing about gays in the military, and teachers would walk around acting "flaming" just to make students laugh and stuff. That's just the way it was. Leigh Combs: You talked to students and, at times, also the teachers and faculty, right? Jessie Tebbin: My high school teacher made one comment once to me about the fact that she knew of other students who had come out after they left my high school, and how she thought that was sad, that they had to wait that long. Because they were people that everyone really looked up to. And just her saying that, there was just this fleeting, passing comment in the conversation - and I don't even know what the conversation was about, but I remember that. And when I was coming out, my mind would always go back to that comment, you know, like well, if there is somebody that I need to connect with back home, maybe that is the person I'll do that with. Or even just teachers challenge students in class saying faggot and dyke and stuff like that. It's such little things and yet I think it will make a difference. The harder thing's going to be like the administration. And the parents, too, because in a small town you talk about sex in school, sometimes you talk about condoms, and you say the word and you have parents calling everyone. There are people in rural areas, they're queer, and they are there. I'm just now finding out about it and it's so strange that I had to move 300 miles away to an urban center to be able to recognize all these people that were there that all my life I never knew about. Leigh Combs: What kind of advice would you give to young people out there that may be listening who want to start a support group, or a gay/straight alliance in their school? Who want to, you know, do something. What would you say to them? Jessie Tebbin: It takes a lot of courage, but I think when youth come forward and try to do things like that in their school, they have to be obviously aware that it's not going to be, like, ice cream-land or anything, but it's worth the effort, because there are people in the world who are going to recognize that courage. And even if it doesn't work in your home town, some day it will. And you're the one that started that, and think of how good it will feel to know that some day when your home town is safe, you're one of the first people who laid down the first brick in the process. Phillip Babich: Jessie Tebbin, an intern at District 202 in Minneapolis, speaking with Leigh Combs. That's it for this edition of Making Contact...a look at the experiences of queer youth. Thanks for listening. Special thanks this week Stephanie Welch who helped write and produce this program. Margot Schrire provided production assistance. Laura Livoti is our managing director. Peggy Law is executive director. Our production assistant is Shereen Meraji. Norman Solomon is senior advisor. Our national producer is David Barsamian. And I'm your host and managing producer Phillip Babich. If you want more information about the subject of this week's program, call the National Radio Project at 800-529-5736. Call that same phone number for tapes and transcripts. Making Contact is an independent production. We're committed to providing a forum for voices and opinions not often heard in the mass media. If you have suggestions for future programs, we'd like to hear from you. Our theme music is by the Charlie Hunter Trio. 'Bye for now. |